Discussion:
Pekka de Terry 148
(too old to reply)
TJT2
2014-10-13 04:49:47 UTC
Permalink
Grootille taas kumottavaa, vaikka uhosta huolimatta KAIKKI edellisetkin
"uusnatsien" väitteet on kumoamatta
x x x clip x x x
[148] On p. 210 Terry invokes Himmler's infamous Posen speech,
but apparently finds it too notorious to dwell upon, so he instead quotes
the following related comment by Goebbels:

"As far as the Jewish question is concerned, he [Himmler] gives a very
unvarnished and frank presentation. He is convinced that we can solve the
Jewish question throughout Europe by the end of this year. He proposes the
harshest and most radical solution: to exterminate the Jews root and
branch [Kind und Kegel]. It is certainly a logical solution, even if it is a
brutal one. We have to take responsibility of completely solving this issue
in
our time."

The source adduced by Terry is "TBJG II/10, p.72; cf. Saul
Friedländer, The Years of Extermination: Nazi Germany and the Jews,
1939-1945. New York: HarperCollins, 2008, p.543" (footnote 327), but
in fact both text and reference are derived from Friedländer's book: "Joseph
Goebbels, Die Tagebücher von Joseph Goebbels; ed. Elke Fröh
lich (Munich, 1995), vol. 10, p. 72."1184

First of all I give the German text of the passage:1185
"Was die Judenfrage anlangt, so gibt er [Himmler] darüber ein ganz
ungeschminktes und freimütiges Bild. Er ist der Überzeugung, daß wir die
Judenfrage bis Ende dieses Jahres für ganz Europa lösen können. Er tritt
für die radikalste und härteste Lösung ein, nämlich dafür, das Judentum
mit Kind und Kegel auszurotten. Sicherlich ist das eine wenn auch brutale,
so doch konsequente Lösung. Denn wir müssen schon die Verantwortung
dafür übernehmen, daß diese Frage zu unserer Zeit ganz gelöst wird."

"Concerning the Jewish question, he [Himmler] offers a completely
unvarnished
and candid view. He is convinced that we can solve the Jewish
question for all of Europe by the end of this year. He advocates the most
radical and toughest solution, namely to exterminate Jewry with bag and
baggage. Though brutal, this is certainly a consistent solution. Because we
really must assume responsibility so that this question is solved in our
time."

In the Posen speech Himmler declared:1186

"Ich meine jetzt die Judenevakuierung, die Ausrottung des jüdischen
Volkes"
"I mean here the Jewish evacuation, the extermination of the Jewish
people."

This sentence is commonly interpreted in the sense that "evacuation
[Evakuierung]" is a "euphemism" for "extermination [Ausrottung]."
But the paragraph in which this sentence appears bear the title "The
Jewish evacuation [Die Judenevakuierung]." It must be noted here that
Himmler did not speak to a village fair audience, but "at the
SS-Gruppenführer
conference in Posen on 4 October 1943 [bei der SS-Gruppenführertagung
in Posen am 4. Oktober 1943],"1187 to wit - from the exterminationist
perspective - in front of the perpetrators of the alleged
extermination of the Jews. Why would Himmler have used a "euphemism"
when addressing them?

The most reasonable explanation is that
the two terms are strictly equivalent, although in reverse to the common
interpretation, i.e. that "extermination [Ausrottung]" is a figurative
synonym
of "evacuation [Evakuierung]." This is moreover confirmed by
several examples which I adduced in chapter 5.

In this context quite explicit statements by Himmler can be quoted,
as the following one, taken from a speech in front of SS-Junker (aspiring
SS officers) in Bad Tölz on 23 November 1942:1188

"Völlig gewandelt hat sich auch die Judenfrage in Europa. Der Führer
sagte einmal in einer Reichsrede: Wenn das Judentum einen internationalen
Krieg etwa zur Ausrottung der arischer Völker anzetteln sollte, so
werden nicht die arischen Völker ausgerottet, sondern das Judentum. Der
Jude ist aus Deutschland ausgesiedelt, er lebt heute im Osten und arbeitet
an unseren Straßen, Bahnen usw. Dieser Prozeß ist konsequent, aber ohne
Grausamkeit durchgeführt worden. Wir quälen niemand, aber wir wissen,
daß wir um unsere Existenz und die Erhaltung unseres nordischen Blutes
kämpfen."

"There has also been a complete change in the Jewish question in Europe.
The Führer once said in a speech before the Reichstag: If Jewry were
to instigate a war, for example to eradicate the Aryan peoples, it will not
be
the Aryan peoples that will be eradicated, but Jewry. The Jew has been
removed
from Germany; he now lives in the East and works on our roads,
railways etc. This measure has been carried out thoroughly, but without
any cruelty. We will not torture anyone, but we know that we are fighting
for the existence and the survival of our Nordic blood."

This also confirms once more the real meaning of Hitler's "prophecy."
The general context is the one given above (in point 141): while Hitler
previously "held the view that the solution of the Jewish problem in
countries other than in Germany would have to be postponed until after
the end of the war, this now no longer holds good and the Führer has issued
categorical instructions to the effect that the question must be settled
immediately," that is to say that he took the decision "to remove all
Jews from Europe still during the war [alle Juden noch während des
Krieges aus Europa zu entfernen]."
x x x clop x x x
28-tecoar-long.pdf
Pointtina mm. "...The Jew has been removed
from Germany; he now lives in the East and works on our roads,
railways etc. This measure has been carried out thoroughly, but without
any cruelty. We will not torture anyone, but we know that we are fighting
for the existence and the survival of our Nordic blood."
--
--TJT--
Kaksi samantapaista mutta ei samanlaista määritelmää antaa kuvan siitä, että
asiaa ei todella itsekään ymmärretä.
- evolutionisti Raimo Suonio
TJT2
2014-11-22 11:02:03 UTC
Permalink
(uudelleenpostaus tämäkin, P de G:n valitettua viestien katoamisesta, vaikka
oikeasti taisi kadota vain P de G kun "uusnatsien" kama olikin paljon
kovempaa kuin mitä hän luuli...)
Grootille taas kumottavaa, vaikka uhosta huolimatta KAIKKI edellisetkin
"uusnatsien" väitteet on kumoamatta
x x x clip x x x
[148] On p. 210 Terry invokes Himmler's infamous Posen speech,
but apparently finds it too notorious to dwell upon, so he instead quotes
the following related comment by Goebbels:

"As far as the Jewish question is concerned, he [Himmler] gives a very
unvarnished and frank presentation. He is convinced that we can solve the
Jewish question throughout Europe by the end of this year. He proposes the
harshest and most radical solution: to exterminate the Jews root and
branch [Kind und Kegel]. It is certainly a logical solution, even if it is a
brutal one. We have to take responsibility of completely solving this issue
in our time."

The source adduced by Terry is "TBJG II/10, p.72; cf. Saul
Friedländer, The Years of Extermination: Nazi Germany and the Jews,
1939-1945. New York: HarperCollins, 2008, p.543" (footnote 327), but
in fact both text and reference are derived from Friedländer's book: "Joseph
Goebbels, Die Tagebücher von Joseph Goebbels; ed. Elke Fröh
lich (Munich, 1995), vol. 10, p. 72."1184

First of all I give the German text of the passage:1185
"Was die Judenfrage anlangt, so gibt er [Himmler] darüber ein ganz
ungeschminktes und freimütiges Bild. Er ist der Überzeugung, daß wir die
Judenfrage bis Ende dieses Jahres für ganz Europa lösen können. Er tritt
für die radikalste und härteste Lösung ein, nämlich dafür, das Judentum
mit Kind und Kegel auszurotten. Sicherlich ist das eine wenn auch brutale,
so doch konsequente Lösung. Denn wir müssen schon die Verantwortung
dafür übernehmen, daß diese Frage zu unserer Zeit ganz gelöst wird."

"Concerning the Jewish question, he [Himmler] offers a completely
unvarnished and candid view. He is convinced that we can solve
the Jewish question for all of Europe by the end of this year. He
advocates the most radical and toughest solution, namely to
exterminate Jewry with bag and baggage. Though brutal, this is
certainly a consistent solution. Because we really must assume
responsibility so that this question is solved in our time."

In the Posen speech Himmler declared:1186

"Ich meine jetzt die Judenevakuierung, die Ausrottung des jüdischen
Volkes"
"I mean here the Jewish evacuation, the extermination of the Jewish
people."

This sentence is commonly interpreted in the sense that "evacuation
[Evakuierung]" is a "euphemism" for "extermination [Ausrottung]."
But the paragraph in which this sentence appears bear the title "The
Jewish evacuation [Die Judenevakuierung]." It must be noted here that
Himmler did not speak to a village fair audience, but "at the
SS-Gruppenführer
conference in Posen on 4 October 1943 [bei der SS-Gruppenführertagung
in Posen am 4. Oktober 1943],"1187 to wit - from the exterminationist
perspective - in front of the perpetrators of the alleged
extermination of the Jews. Why would Himmler have used a "euphemism"
when addressing them?

The most reasonable explanation is that the two terms are strictly
equivalent, although in reverse to the common
interpretation, i.e. that "extermination [Ausrottung]" is a figurative
synonym
of "evacuation [Evakuierung]." This is moreover confirmed by
several examples which I adduced in chapter 5.

In this context quite explicit statements by Himmler can be quoted,
as the following one, taken from a speech in front of SS-Junker (aspiring
SS officers) in Bad Tölz on 23 November 1942:1188

"Völlig gewandelt hat sich auch die Judenfrage in Europa. Der Führer
sagte einmal in einer Reichsrede: Wenn das Judentum einen internationalen
Krieg etwa zur Ausrottung der arischer Völker anzetteln sollte, so
werden nicht die arischen Völker ausgerottet, sondern das Judentum. Der
Jude ist aus Deutschland ausgesiedelt, er lebt heute im Osten und arbeitet
an unseren Straßen, Bahnen usw. Dieser Prozeß ist konsequent, aber ohne
Grausamkeit durchgeführt worden. Wir quälen niemand, aber wir wissen,
daß wir um unsere Existenz und die Erhaltung unseres nordischen Blutes
kämpfen."

"There has also been a complete change in the Jewish question in Europe.
The Führer once said in a speech before the Reichstag: If Jewry were
to instigate a war, for example to eradicate the Aryan peoples, it will not
be the Aryan peoples that will be eradicated, but Jewry. The Jew has
been removed from Germany; he now lives in the East and
works on our roads, railways etc. This measure has been carried
out thoroughly, but without any cruelty. We will not torture anyone,
but we know that we are fighting
for the existence and the survival of our Nordic blood."

This also confirms once more the real meaning of Hitler's "prophecy."
The general context is the one given above (in point 141): while Hitler
previously "held the view that the solution of the Jewish problem in
countries other than in Germany would have to be postponed until after
the end of the war, this now no longer holds good and the Führer has issued
categorical instructions to the effect that the question must be settled
immediately," that is to say that he took the decision "to remove all
Jews from Europe still during the war [alle Juden noch während des
Krieges aus Europa zu entfernen]."
x x x clop x x x
28-tecoar-long.pdf
Pointtina mm. "...The Jew has been removed
from Germany; he now lives in the East and works on our roads,
railways etc. This measure has been carried out thoroughly, but without
any cruelty. We will not torture anyone, but we know that we are fighting
for the existence and the survival of our Nordic blood."
--
--TJT--
Atheists will never be satisfied because they are not seeking truth, they
are seeking to guard a paradigm.
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